TRADES THAT WON’T HAPPEN

Posted by: Philadunkia
02/21/13 12:08 pm EST

After last night’s loss in Minnesota and DC’s post game comments, the 2012-2013 season is nearly a wrap for the 76ers.  To be honest, outside of Jrue Holiday’s All-Star campaign, this year has been a highly disappointing one for the 7-6. 

That disappointment will continue today as it’s very unlikely that the 76ers are major players at the trade deadline.  Toni Dileo squashed any sliver of hope we had left when he came out and said, “we don’t plan on making any moves”

Why any NBA front office person would make that statement and show his poker hand just before the trade deadline is a mystery to us here at Philadunkia, but that’s another post for another time.

After the jump, Philadunkia scribes Jake Fischer and Steve Toll each propose three deals that the Sixers should make today because the trades potentially make sense for the future of this franchise.  

 

Steve Toll

Trade #1:  (Trade Machine)

Wright, Hawes, Turner, Lavoy, Moultrie to Detroit

for

Maggette, Jason Maxiell and Will Bynum 

Why Detroit does this?  Joe Dumars isn’t in love with the free agent class this year and with his team near a playoff spot, decides to make a run at the 14-15 free agent class.  With all but Moultrie, expiring by the end of next year, this gives the Pistons the flexibility for the present and future.  Detroit is now a contender for the last 2 playoff spots in the East with the depth to make a first round series interesting if Drummond makes a healthy return.

Why Philly does this?  Its quite simple.  Clear up some cap space and get a better lottery pick. 

Trade #2(Trade Machine)

Thad, Moultrie, 76ers 2013 2nd rd pick to Utah

for

Marvin Williams, Raja Bell, Utah + GSWs 2013 1st rd picks (Both Lottery Protected)

Why Utah does this?  Thaddeus Young is better than Marvin Williams, is paid less and is signed for 3 more seasons.  Moultrie won’t be of use this year but he is young and cheap.

Why Philly does this?  The CBA.  Thad is a great young player, but getting 2 draft picks and having a ton of cap space for the 14-15 off-season is the move to make here.  Marvin Williams fills the void at SF next year and then vanishes from the cap.  The two 1st round picks project to be late teen’s-early 20’s and with a bit of luck 1 of the 2 will be a productive NBA player for the 76ers.  This is another move that will help the team but the benefits will not show until 14-15.

Trade #3:

Bynum to Phoenix

Marcin Gortat, Jared Dudley to OKC

Kendrick Perkins, Jeremy Lamb, Markieff Morris, Perry Jones to Philadelphia. 

The 76ers also get Raptors’ 2013 first-round pick (Top 3 protected and 15-30 in 2013, top 2 protected and 15-30 in 2014 and ’15, Top 1 protected and 15-30 in 2016 and ’17, and unprotected in 2018

Why PHX does it?  Gortat wants out, Morris is above replacement level and Dudley while good value isn’t worth holding up a trade for a potential franchise center when the Suns have the best training staff in the NBA

Why OKC does it?  This massively improves the team and makes them title favorites the next 2 years

Why Philly does it?  It improves the 76ers lottery pick this year and the Raptors pick is of value.  Morris, Lamb, Jones all project to become useful NBA players in the next few years.  Kendrick Perkins sucks, but there is hope he could return to ~average.

Wins will be hard to come by this year and next but this trade paves the way for a bright future if the front office can grab some quality players out of the draft and free agency.


Jake Fischer

Trade #1: (Trade Machine)

Andrew Bynum to Utah

for

Al Jefferson and Enes Kantor

then Spencer Hawes and Moultrie to Charlotte

Ramon Sessions to Utah

Why Utah Does It?   The Jazz are looking to clear up space for their young bigs. With that, why not take two of their front court players off of their hands and give them the *potentially* best young big man in the game, in Bynum?

Why Philly Does Do It?  After this nightmare first season with Andrew Bynum in Philly, there is no guarantee the big man will resign. A front-court rotation of Jefferson, Thad Young, Kantor and Lavoy Allen is definitely capable of wrecking some havoc in a relatively small Eastern Conference. A Jefferson-Thad High low combo could also prove lethal in some half-court sets. People have forgotten how dynamic Big Al could be on the Block

Why Charlotte Does It?  The moves allows the Bobcats to get Ramon Sessions out Kemba Walker’s to develop. There’s no rumor or speculation they want to get rid of Sessions, but it would make sense. In addition, bringing in Hawes and Moultire would add two young bigs with upside as semi-legitimate options down low to a frontcourt currently featured around Byron Mullens. Hawes and Moultrie are probably better options than an overpaid Tyrus Thomas, Desigana Diop’s expiring contract and the skeleton of Brendan Haywood.

Trade #2:   (Trade Machine)

Evan Turner and Arnett Moultire to Sacramento

for

Tyreke Evans

(Now, Tom Haberstroh wrote this in an ESPN.com column this week. But, in fairness I texted my dad and brother (76ers’ season ticket holders) and Philadunkia Editor, Carey Smith, this idea a few weeks ago, calling Tyreke and Evan the definitions of “scenery change guys”.)

Why Philly Does It?  If Collins schemes his roster the right way AND Bynum was healthy down the stretch (Understandably two BIG if’s) the Sixers could start Jrue, N Young, D Wright, Thad Young and Bynum, with Tyreke coming off the bench.  Tyreke would spearhead the offensive attack in the second unit for 10-15 minutes per game as Jrue is on the bench — way more affectively than Turner is doing now.  He’s also in a contract year and would play out of his mind trying to help will this team to the playoffs and earn some big bucks.

Why Sacramento Does It?  If the Kings deal either Cousins or Evans, it makes sense they would deal both and start fresh to move past their losing persona.  With that, if Cousins is gone from Sac-Town, the Kings could add a former No. 2 pick in Turner –who many outside of Philly believe still has upside –and get a built, rebounding young big who can grow and prosper with playing time as well.

Trade #3:  (Trade Machine)

Evan Turner and Lavoy Allen to Minnesota

for

Andre Kirilenko

Why Philly Does It?  At this point, it’s pretty illogical to think that Turner will develop the defensive capabilities to consistently stop any Top 10 scorer in the league.  With that, Collins has been forced to use Jrue, Swaggy P or Damien Wilkins to attempt to slow down guys like Carmelo Anthony, Lebron James and Paul George.  That clearly doesn’t work. Dealing for Kirilenko would add a Bruce Bowen-type defender who can knock down wide-open corner threes to a starting lineup that desperately needs to help defensively on the perimeter.  His contract is a little steep, but is only for one more season following this year.  If things work out, maybe the team could restructure AK47’s contract before the 2013-2014 season with a (god-willing) healthy Jrue Holiday, Thad Young, Andrew Bynum, (insert random SG) and Kirilenko starting lineup.

Why Minnesota Does It?  With his relative unhappiness up north, it seems as though Kevin Love may be leaving the North for a warmer and more optimistic location.  Bringing in Turner –again some believe he still has star potential –to replace Love’s star power and Lavoy as another big man could ease the pain of a Love departure in the near future.  Or, if Love stays, a starting lineup of Rubio, Bradon Roy, Evan Turner, Kevin Love and Nikola Pekovic isn’t a terible option to compete for a 6-8 seed in the Western Conference.


 
 
 

38 Responses to “TRADES THAT WON’T HAPPEN”

  1. Adam
    21. February 2013 at 13:41

    The only trade i like a lot is trade 3 from toll….

    Only way okc does it is if they think they can resign kevin martin to a reasonable deal.

  2. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 13:45

    Jake,

    Utah isn’ t going to tank its playoff chances this year AND give away Enes Kanter, a very good YOUNG CHEAP prospect, just to get Andrew Bynum……

    AK47 would unquestionably be the BEST player on the 76ers, he is one of the 40 best guys in the NBA. His contract isn’t steep, its a DISCOUNT and there is no deal restructuring in the NBA.

  3. Jon
    21. February 2013 at 14:46

    I’ve already submitted this to the league office for approval. http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=a7cehkb

  4. Jake Fischer
    21. February 2013 at 14:46

    Steve,

    Utah’s got A LOT going for them as a 7-seed in a loaded Western Conference. They’re not going to win more than two games this postseason. What good does it have for them to make the postseason, maybe get swept and pick at 16 or 17 instead of 9-14?

    In terms of Kirelinko, his contract is a little steep in terms of trying to bring in another scorer this offseason. If they brought in Kirelinko, they’d have nearly $50 million tied up between Bynum, Holiday, AK and Thad. I also said, maybe. I never said that a restructure could happen.

    In regards to Adam, the only trade I really like and would actually want them to do is the deal for Tyreke Evans. His potential is incredible.

  5. freezer
    21. February 2013 at 15:25

    would def love to trade in turner for tyreke prob a good trade for everyone

  6. ken
    21. February 2013 at 16:09

    I like tolls third trade the best but ill throw the same question hes thrown at me the last couple weeks for my trades involving Bynum. why would the suns trade for Bynum when they can sign him outright in the offseason

  7. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 16:10

    Jake,

    I love the trade for Philly but Utah would be getting smoked. You’re advocating for Utah to trade the #3 pick in the 2011 draft, who isn’t even 21 years old and has been sitting/learning behind 2 borderline All-Stars the last 2 years, for the chance to move from the 18th pick to the 14th, 13th, 12th pick and a less than 5% chance at a top 3 pick.

    As for the AK47 trade, he has a player option for next year and he is 0% barring a major injury to pick that up, he will be an unrestricted free agent AND the 76ers wouldn’t even have his Bird Rights this offseason. If Kirilenko doesn’t want to stay in Philly (and why would he) the team is beat

    You implied a restructuring was possible, it is not.

    Jason Richardson should be healthy by the start of next season, Dorell Wright can be retained through Bird Rights, and the team has a lottery pick to use. The only way a scorer is being brought in through free agency is if Bynum walks.

    The only feasible trade is ET for Tyreke and only because the Kings front office is the gang who can’t shoot straight. Tyreke will be a useful NBA player for the next 10 years.
    ET will be useless sans 1 out of every 8ish games the rest of his career

  8. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 16:31

    AK47 is putting up these numbers this year:

    13pts, 6 REB, 3ast, 1.5stl, 1.2 blks per game in a season

    Barkley, Rick Barry, Bird, Drexler, Erving, Jordan, Kidd, Malone, Wilkins, Payton, Olajuwan and Pippen are the only other guys 31 or older to average at least

  9. Rick
    21. February 2013 at 17:41

    I would love to see your top 40 Steve.

  10. Rick
    21. February 2013 at 17:54

    Very disappointed we did not make any moves. I hope that our owner is not still stuck on the idea that we did not see the whole team play together yet, and that is the reason why we didn’t make any moves. I can’t imagine going into next season with this team and a healthy Andrew Bynum. There will be some bright spots, but I believe they will be few and far between. If we really could have did that Josh Smith trade for hawes and evan turner and we didn’t do it because josh might not sign, than we are crazy. Oh well if he doesn’t sign, we have a bad year and try to get somebody in the 2014 free agent class. Evan Turner and Spencer Hawes are replaceable and will not be missed. I think he would have signed if we brought back Andrew Bynum though. He’s not getting a max contract from anyone, so we would not have been forced to give him one.

    Ps.

    I have no idea how we are risking our future by giving up evan turner and spencer hawes. SMH. I have no idea what this teams plans are, can someone explain please.

  11. Alex
    21. February 2013 at 18:16

    Assuming Bynam returns in a decent (but not 100%)shape, and does not ask for max, this team will have good cap space to get a decent player or two.
    Assuming Bynam is gone, then sixers have a very good cap space and can get two very good players.
    Also too soon to give up on Turner. I feel he will eventually be better than Thad.

  12. MattSg
    21. February 2013 at 18:42

    I hope we can sign paul millsap in the off season

  13. RYN_JAY
    21. February 2013 at 19:44

    Rick, I completely agree with you. If it’s true that we turned down sending Spencer and Evan for Josh Smith then I will be extremely upset. I understand the risk involved, but so was getting Bynum. You would probably have a better chance resigning both of them than just one.

  14. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 20:01

    Alex,

    The 76ers will have less than $15,000,000 in cap space this summer if Bynum isn’t resigned.

    Rick,

    Not exactly in order but something like this, pure total production this year and going forward predictions

    Lebron, Durant, Paul, Harden, Parker, Harden, Wade, Chandler, Duncan, KG, Wade, Griffin, Aldridge, Kobe, Curry, Melo, Westbrook, Noah, George, Marc Gasol, Bosh, Iggy, D12, Lee, Horford, AK47, RAnderson, Millsap, ZBO, Ibaka, Gallinari, Brook, Faried, Monroe, Pekovik, Josh Smith, David West, Asik, Deng, Pierce, Calderon, Thad, Parsons, Irivng, Lowry, NeNe

  15. Ms. Haygood
    21. February 2013 at 20:18

    Trade Doug Collins for Mike Budenholzer

    Keep tanking and draft Victor Oladipo

    Let Bynum walk

    Make some trades this summer that will bring in some young athletic guys and build from there.

  16. Rick
    21. February 2013 at 22:44

    I said TOP 40. This list should not involve your favorite players(Calderon,Asik) and players that should not crack the top 60(AK47).

    Try again let’s be serious this time. Couple players you missed (Rose, Ginobli, Rondo)

  17. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 23:50

    Rick,

    You need to work on your reading comprehension…..

    I gave you a list based on production this year+going forward, this isn’t a list of best players, it’s a list of most productive players.

    Production > Ability

    Bynum, Rose, Varejao, Rondo, Granger are all hurt, they are effectively worthless

    Manu has missed 13 games and plays 23 minutes per game.

    Asik is 57th in total minutes, has a 55.7 TS%, leads the NBA in rebounds and is an elite interior defender.

    Calderon is 8th in the entire NBA in offensive win shares. His defense is sub-par but offensively, few players are as valuable as Calderon.

    AK47 is awesome. He does everything and plays elite defense
    34mpg,13.3pts, 6.2 rebs, 3ast, 1.5 STL, 1.2 blks
    He would unquestionably be the best/most productive player on the 76ers.

  18. Steve Toll
    21. February 2013 at 23:51

    Rick,

    Who is better Jrue or AK47 and why?

  19. Jim
    22. February 2013 at 00:12

    Steve,

    OKC never does that deal you proposed. That’s way too much to give up for Gortat and Dudley and they have the best GM in the league.

  20. ken
    22. February 2013 at 02:19

    rick not to mention he put harden up there twice…..embarassing

  21. Rick
    22. February 2013 at 03:12

    I know exactly what you wrote, that is why I explained what I wanted. I will say it again, the TOP 40 players in the league, not players that are having a good year. Having a good year does not make you a top 40 player.

    Come on Steve stop asking me dumb questions. Jrue or AK47? You mix up role players with players that are asked to run the team. Jrue is the star of our team and has no help. This leads to low efficiency and turnovers because he ends up trying to do too much, and teams only have to focus on him. Ak47 has Ricky Rubio penetrating and feeding him wide open shots. He has Pekovic down low causing double teams which also gives him good looks. Not to mention when Kevin Love is playing, he ends up being the 3rd or 4th option. Put him on our roster and swap him out for Jrue and see how valuable he is then. Star players can make role players look great in their role. Take those star players away and you just have an average player. I’m not saying AK47 is not a good player, but he is good as a role player, you can’t compare him to Jrue, there is no comparison.

    Ps.

    Those numbers look a lot like evan turners numbers. AK47 plays better defense.
    MPG 36.3 PPG 13.8 AST 4.3 REB 6.6 STL 0.6 BLK 0.2

    Nothing like Jrue’s numbers.
    MPG 38.3 PPG 19.0 AST 8.8 REB 4.2 STL 1.5

  22. Rick
    22. February 2013 at 03:19

    Ken,

    He put Wade up there twice too, but that is not what I was looking for, I was looking for him to put players like AK47 and Asik up there, and that didn’t fail. But, I’ll give him a chance to answer again since he did not understand what I was asking him.

  23. Steve Toll
    22. February 2013 at 09:36

    Jim,

    Please tell me more, I’m interested in hearing your opinion.

    What would/should OKC give up for Gortat+Dudley hypothetically???

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=gortama01&y1=2013&p2=dudleja01&y2=2013

    How can you be the best gm in the league when your team hasn’t won an NBA championship? I’d argue that the best gm in the NBA is whomever wins the championship each year, for obvious reasons

  24. Jake Fischer
    22. February 2013 at 11:41

    I’m never opposed to writers being called out for their mistakes. Steve, that Top 40 was weak.

  25. RYN_JAY
    22. February 2013 at 11:42

    I’m praying that we can draft Oladipo.

  26. cool whip
    22. February 2013 at 12:06

    Steve,

    You would seriously put AK in the top 40 in productivity over the likes of Joe Johnson, Bledsoe and his own teammate Ricky Rubio? And you gotta stop with the Ak is better than Jrue this year. One of them is an all star and the other is old.

  27. Steve Toll
    22. February 2013 at 12:23

    Cool Whip,

    You have put me at a tough decision. I’d like to explain how hilariously wrong you are, but I also recognize that by having those thoughts, it’s likely impossible for you to understand even the simplest of concepts relating to basketball

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bledser01&y1=2013&p2=johnsjo02&y2=2013&p3=kirilan01&y3=2013&p4=rubiori01&y4=2013&p5=holidjr01&y5=2013

    AK47 is by far the best defensive player of this group, that isn’t even up for debate and even you should acknowledge that fact.

    AK47 has the highest offensive rating and is 2nd in offensive wins shares among this group. His PER is 2nd to Bledsoe by .4 and his TS% is 7.6% higher than the next guy. His WS48 is .024 higher than the next best guy.

    His Roland Rating is the best among the group, as is his RAPM both offensively and defensively

    Going by pure on-off numbers, he far exceeds any of the guys you mentioned in his effect of on-off numbers.

    Jrue is one of the worst All-Stars in history on the level of some of the Iverson selections and Chris Kaman type guys.

    Notice that I have many many many many haters (who dont have a clue) and none of them in the comment section here or the game 52 reacts
    http://philadunkia.com/?p=8437 AND NONE BUT YOU HAVE CHIMED IN SUGGESTING that Jrue > AK47.

  28. Steve Toll
    22. February 2013 at 12:30

    Rick,

    Your incompetence is only exceeded by Jeff and RobY. Kevin Love has played 18 games, slightly over 600 minutes this year.
    Think what you what, but the fact is you don’t have a clue.

    There isn’t a publicly available advanced metric that has Jrue > Kirilenko except for Versatility Index, which doesnt account for defense.

    Keep being a casual fan with no idea of anything and being totally ignorant about simple basketball concepts.

  29. Steve Toll
    22. February 2013 at 12:32

    Jake Fischer,

    Give me a better list of “top 40 pure total production this year and going forward projections”

    and please respond to this
    “I love the trade for Philly but Utah would be getting smoked. You’re advocating for Utah to trade the #3 pick in the 2011 draft, who isn’t even 21 years old and has been sitting/learning behind 2 borderline All-Stars the last 2 years, for the chance to move from the 18th pick to the 14th, 13th, 12th pick and a less than 5% chance at a top 3 pick.

    As for the AK47 trade, he has a player option for next year and he is 0% barring a major injury to pick that up, he will be an unrestricted free agent AND the 76ers wouldn’t even have his Bird Rights this offseason. If Kirilenko doesn’t want to stay in Philly (and why would he) the team is beat

    You implied a restructuring was possible, it is not.

    Jason Richardson should be healthy by the start of next season, Dorell Wright can be retained through Bird Rights, and the team has a lottery pick to use. The only way a scorer is being brought in through free agency is if Bynum walks.

    The only feasible trade is ET for Tyreke and only because the Kings front office is the gang who can’t shoot straight. Tyreke will be a useful NBA player for the next 10 years.
    ET will be useless sans 1 out of every 8ish games the rest of his career”

  30. Steve Toll
    22. February 2013 at 12:49

    Rick,

    Rubio and Love have played 1300 MINUTES THIS YEAR.

    That would only be good for 131st in the NBA this season

    COMBINED those 2 have a 46.1 TS%

  31. Chief Royster
    22. February 2013 at 14:47

    Im going to throw an angle out here also, AK47 is not marketable.. Jrue is.. that has to account for something and it wont show up on anybody’s made up formulas and stat sheets. People will watch the Sixers no matter how crappy they are doing because Jrue is 22 and has a flash about his game that is pleasing to the eyes, the intangables which are not tracked in the fancy numbers. You look at players on the court and can plainly see if a person has talent or not. Last time I checked, being a star relies heavily on marketability and revenue to the L, being an all star are the real bread winners of the L. If you are 1 of only two people in the entire L averaging at least 18 8 4 (westbrook)and you are only 22, you are going to be an all star (one that the coaches picked, not a dwight howard fan pick b.s.), not only because your stats say you deserve it , but because it’s a business. If that wasn’t the case you can watch these guys play ball at the playground and keep stats on them if you feel like. In Philly, Jrue is the ticket like it or not. Plus he gets buckets. And dimes. AK game is garbage to look at and he does not get buckets. So if we sit here and try to throw cap space and financial sense into team trading decisions the fact of who puts butts in seats has to be equated. Iverson, no matter what is felt about him has incredible numbers and and a superstar in the league. Incredible talent in a small package with a world wide image. $$$ to the league. I can probobly go down to Susquehanna and pull somebody that could of put up the same stats as Iverson in that situation. But he would not be marketable. I watched the Utah commentator the other night say this during the game, Nice pass from Holiday over to Wilkins for the jumpshot, and its off the back iron. Other commentator chimes in with Holiday would probobly lead the league in assist if he had people that could hit shots. Your numbers will reflect the talent around you, but not your personal skill. In order to see that you have to watch the games.

  32. Rick
    22. February 2013 at 18:27

    Steve,

    I have probably played in more games than you have watched. So let’s not go there with the casual fan comment. I don’t need any advanced metric to tell me whether one player is better than another. My advanced metric is my eyes. They have never steered me wrong. I can see getting into numbers with players that are real close like Tony Parker and Chris Paul. But, in this case, we are talking about players that we don’t need to go to the stats for because it is obvious. AK47 career numbers aren’t even as good as Jrue’s, and he has always played on a good team with a good point guard and a down low presence, so it is easier for him to play good in his role. Keep reading, chief cited a good quote and made a very good statement.

    Chief,

    “Other commentator chimes in with Holiday would probobly lead the league in assist if he had people that could hit shots. Your numbers will reflect the talent around you, but not your personal skill. In order to see that you have to watch the games.”

  33. ken
    23. February 2013 at 01:28

    I love how steve is ignoring my first question because he knows he is wrong but calls my out for attempting a similar trade

  34. Steve Toll
    23. February 2013 at 13:56

    Ken,

    If you say so……oh wait you did…… And you’re wrong

    Trading for Bynum now would have guaranteed the Suns finish with the worst record in the NBA, giving them a 25% chance of winning the lottery.

    Gortat is only signed through next year and will be 30 1/2 when he enters free agency.
    He isn’t a piece a lottery team will take and most playoff teams don’t have the assets or won’t give them unless he puts them over the top.

    Dudley is a little different, as he is on a very good deal but giving him up is we’ll worth it if they decide that they want Bynum.

    Nice try though

  35. Steve Toll
    23. February 2013 at 13:57

    Rick,

    You are a casual fan, proof is in the pudding, get over it and do better

  36. Rick
    23. February 2013 at 16:12

    Steve,

    If I’m a casual fan, what are you? You make comments like this….

    “While it is highly unlikely that the team will hire someone with knowledge on how to build a winning team, like myself, DC will probably matriculate to the front office.”

    So obviously you don’t know how hard it is to be a coach and/or gm and/or player. Steve, one day something will click with you and you’ll realize some of things I/we tell you on here, are to teach you about the game. When I first started watching/playing basketball, I thought I knew it all like you do now. Once you start watching basketball more you’ll realize some of the things we tell you are from experience from watching thousands of games. Your a beginner so you can’t tell me anything about what’s going on on the floor. You have to go to your stats, which you think is sure fire, which in reality they are not. I’ll let you go through your hard-headed stage, one day you’ll learn steve, one day…

  37. Steve Toll
    23. February 2013 at 17:13

    Rick,

    The best team usually wins, get over it.

  38. Steve Toll
    23. February 2013 at 18:41

    Jakey,

    Please explain

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=bowenbr01&y1=2003&p2=kirilan01&y2=2013

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